S5E05 · Sarah Blackmore

- That was a good sync. - Synchronization. Hello, beautiful people. Welcome back to the Verdi podcast. It is an absolute pleasure to have one of the more wonderful humans going around on today. - You're gonna make me blush. - Sezi B, Sarah Blackmore. - Hi. - How are ya? - Good, how are you? - Excellent, now. You just rocked my schedule by coming early, but we love that because we can talk for longer and talk about some things. So, a little background on Sezi B, Verdi OG. Been here a long time. Left us for a few years, but she's back in business now.

And she's also running probably the best ninja gym in the world. Glad movement. Get around it. Former coach, athlete, just wonderful human. Little bit spicy. - Just a little. - Which we love. - Just a little. - So we are going to be going off on some tangents today. - Hell yeah. - But we're here for it. Sezi, welcome. - Thank you. - A little bit of help to the people. Tell us everything we need to know about ya. - Are you wanting me to look at the camera lens? - You just look wherever it makes you happy.

- Okay, cool. I'm Sarah. I, like Locke said, have been coming to Virtus for a little while now. Feel like I've kind of been lucky enough to see how much this place has evolved and how awesome of a place that Locke has made this and all of his team. So, feel very grateful to be here today, which is fun. What else do you want me to say? - Why do you want to do a potty? 'Cause you messaged me a couple of weeks ago and you're like, I want to do this because of... - Well, that is a very, very tricky question.

You got me straight away with the hard one. - I think it's a good place to start because then we can roll from there. Because as soon as you said it, I was like, obviously. - Well. - You'd be great for this. - It's been a while since I've done a podcast. The last one I did was predominantly around mental health, which was like back in the COVID days. So, it was very relevant and made a lot of sense. But now, I've evolved a lot. And I think that a lot of who I am now is very different to back then.

And although, yes, mental health is a massive part of my life still and all of that stuff, I've gotten to a point where I understand myself a lot more now. And I want to be able to help other people that might be feeling very lost in their own skin, which I see every day with young people in the gym. So, I kind of want to be able to talk about, yeah, that transition and how we've kind of built it up and the things that I've used to help me get here. - Love that. - Thanks. - Give us a little like, maybe like checkpoints along the journey through your own mental health journey.

I'm gonna say journey like 17 times. But talk us through your last, say, decade and a half of being a human, becoming a bonafide adult, queen, star, business owner. Like it's been a pretty rad journey. And I've seen you evolve in that time. And I think the people out there probably haven't seen a lot of the stuff that go on beyond the scenes. And unless you do, 'cause you have had periods of time where you've shared it a lot. - Yeah. - Periods of time where you've pulled out. So yeah, give us a little snapshot over the last decade and a half.

And what got you to this seat right now? - Oh man, I think like that extends well past that 10 years. Like for me, I kind of look at my journey from since I was a really young kid. In the last, I think I was about 24 when I got my ADHD diagnosis. So the last like five to six years is where I've seen the massive change for myself. Like I spent a lot of time, especially 10 years ago, like concentrating on my mental health and trying to get better at that. But I think that like it all kind of stems from when I was really young and not really understanding myself and nobody else understanding who I was either.

And then from there kind of getting the ADHD diagnosis and starting to go, hang on a second. There's not actually anything wrong with me. It's just the people that I'm around right now don't understand me. And that for me was like a massive change in growth and helping me and all of that kind of stuff. But yeah, like 10 years ago, I lost my best friend. And that obviously has like a massive impact on you regardless. But for me, I went through so much trauma dealing with that, being neuro spicy and not knowing anything about it.

All of those emotions were so hard for me to understand. So from there, that's kind of like where my journey really, really started to play out. - Yeah, talk me through the diagnosis as a pivotal moment in your development because like I'm six months on from the diagnosis and I almost feel like there's an element of maybe beforehand, I didn't really understand it, right? You don't understand what ADHD is or I think as a society, we pigeonholed into being the kid that can't sit still in the classroom, whereas there's so much more to it. So

first of all, what was it like going through that process being diagnosed, but then for me, it was almost like, this is day one of like figuring out why my brain works the way it is because you're a pretty high functioning human, you have coping mechanisms and you work through it. But what's that been like? - I mean, the moment that I kind of got the diagnosis, like I've always known, everyone's always known. Like people would say to my mum when I was really young, did you give her red cordial today? Why won't she sit still?

Why doesn't she shut up? Why doesn't she like all of this stuff? Everyone's always known, but because I was that good kid, like I was the kid that would stop and listen in class and I wasn't like, yes, I spoke a lot. Like in my self-reports it was, I need to put my hand up more often and like those kinds of things because it wasn't really, really clear and I was so good at masking it, it was never really there. And like, I still remember the day that I had kind of like clicked that that's what it was.

I was at a music festival and a friend of mine has ADHD and I just looked at her and I was like, oh, this makes a lot of sense. Like I do what you do. And I'd said to her like, hey, can I talk to you about this? And she was like, yes, absolutely. And she was the person that helped me through the whole process. She's like, this is where you're gonna find a psychiatrist. This is what they're gonna ask you. This is like all of the things that are gonna happen from here. She's like, you need to get yourself an Apple watch.

You need to get this and you need to get this and this is how you're gonna be able to manage all of these things. - Framework systems. - Yeah, so I was really lucky and grateful in that position that when I got my diagnosis, I had support from somebody else who had already done it. - Yeah. - I think the thing that like was really real for me was the moment you get that diagnosis, it's such a weight off your shoulders. Like it kind of just like clicks and goes, oh, okay. Like not that I need medication, which I'm on medication, but like not that I needed that medication in order to accept it.

It was more so that the moment somebody said to me and gave me that validation of you're like this because of this. And that was like such a massive weight off my shoulders. And from then I kind of just like fell into place. Like everything fell into place. Like I was on antidepressants for a really long time because of like all of my trauma and things like that. And then the moment that I got this diagnosis, we took me off the antidepressants and put me on ADHD medication. And from there, everything just changed. Everything, like I was properly medicated.

I had the right tools in place to be able to deal with things. But I think, yeah, it was a really weird time 'cause it would have been similar to COVID-ish. - Yeah. - I wanna say. - Yeah, what, '29, 2020? - Yeah, yeah, it would have been around COVID that I got that diagnosis. So sitting in your own bedroom for six months straight just thinking about it, it was great. - Taking speed to slow your brain down. - Yeah, that's it, that's all right. My room was not clean, which is really surprising. - It was really, really messy for like three weeks and really clean for like two days.

- Not even, I think it was like 24 hours. - So talk me through the, 'cause I guess the thing I'm learning and through my experience was like, as I was going through the process, I was probably like the flattest I've ever been just in terms of like, 'cause you're reflecting on and you're holding your mirror up to all the shit that you do that's like different or like, 'cause like you said before, the coping and kind of just following the rule or doing the thing as a, you have that high function, but you're like, okay, I need to try and fit in.

But you're almost subconsciously doing it. - I felt. - Totally, totally. - So then reflecting on all of the ways that you're a little bit different, not different is better, all the best people are, right? - That's right. - But I think that I was flat as a tack for probably six weeks going through the process and then when I was diagnosed, I kind of had a couple of meetings with the psych and the mental health GP and I was like, I don't wanna be medicated. I was like super like, I do not wanna be medicated.

And then the doc's like, here's what I think you should. And about 90 seconds, he was like, okay, I should probably give this crap. And then since then, it's kind of like, each step is a little bit more awareness and more kind of building your capacity. Now that you're five years down the path, what has the last say three or four years look like after you kind of had that initial like, oh shit, this is how it should be, this is different. But then essentially you've just been laying on, layering on capacity since then. - Yeah, I think like the first thing that kind of happens is, and this is my experience, that it was exciting.

Like I was really excited about it. I was like, what tools am I gonna put in place? What things am I gonna do to be able to manage this properly? Like, and it was exciting then and there. And then six months down the track, I'm bored of it, because that's just how ADHDs work, right? Like I get six months in and I'm like, okay, cool. But my laundry still isn't done and my dishes are still messy. And there's all of these things. But on like the professional level is where I really like kind of zoned in.

And like, I kind of wish, this is the only time I've ever said this, but I wish I was medicated earlier for my career. - Yep. - And that's it. Like I don't ever wanna say that I wish I was medicated through school because as a young person, I feel like you don't really have a lot of opportunity to be able to articulate what you're feeling. And I think when I first started taking the medication, I was pretty overwhelmed by how much the stimulants are stimulants, right? Like it's, you get dry mouth. You like feel like you're racing all the time.

You get the shakes, you get jittery. Like there's so many things when you're going through that medication trial process that as a young person, I feel like I wouldn't have been able to articulate that properly. And I might have been medicated wrong throughout my childhood. - Yeah. - So. - I like to think I'm somewhat self-aware, but I still struggled. Doc's like, he'll get me to try something. I'll be like, I don't feel great on that. I don't feel right. He's like, what do you mean? I was like, don't feel good. - Yeah, that's it. - No idea.

Like I just don't. - That's it. - And I usually have the capacity to tell how I feel. And I'm like, I just, it just doesn't feel right. That was on the last thing I tried. I was like, not it. And I think that the further you go down the path, you're like, okay, well, there's no one thing that's gonna fix it because you don't need fixing, but that meds, systems, Apple watch, calendar, these are just tools that allow us to, you know, lean on something that's not the chaos of, you know, the ball bouncing around up there going, I wanna do this, I wanna do this, I wanna do this.

What's the only thing? - Yeah, totally. That's it. I think the best way I've ever explained it, and I mostly explained to kids this way, is like inside your brain is like driving to someone's house. So you get all the way along and then all of a sudden there's a roadblock and you're like, oh, now I need to go a different way. I've never been able to go this way before. And then you've got to like loop around everything and go the other way to another person's house. And I think that's a really good visual, what was for me anyway, of how to understand it.

And I think that's a lot of things that we're struggling right now is understanding it. I know it's getting better, but yeah. - Yeah, and I think that the stigma of this is what it is, more like more, and this is an interesting conversation 'cause like more people are going through the diagnosis process and more people are being medicated and more people are being diagnosed. But like the amount of content I'm seeing about it from a social media perspective, the amount of people in my life I'm talking to about it, we're layering on this understanding of, okay, well, you're not broken, it's just we have executive dysfunction and dopamine dysregulation.

And when we understand that these are things, sure, we still fall into the hole of scrolling and doing fun things and buying shit to try and like fill that dopamine. But you realise that, okay, well, this is one of the reasons why I do this. And then all it is for me, it's like a pattern recognition thing of like, oh, when I start doing this, this is what happens. So I need to make sure that I have this thing checked in or I do this first thing on a Monday morning and things like that. And

then essentially from there, it's just like, okay, well, now I have the capacity to actually respond to an email without doing six different things at once. - Yeah, totally. I think, yeah, that was like one of the hardest things for me, I mean, it's still is. I'm so bad with emails, I'm so bad with communication. If you look at my phone right now, I've got like 500 and something to unread messages. I didn't, I'm sorry. It's honestly like for me as well, I feel like I do want to be better. I really do, but I'll

say it and I kind of wanna get rid of my watch now, but I'll see it come through and I'm like, oh, cool, I need to respond to that. And in my head I've responded. - Well, 'cause you wanna give it the time that maybe it deserves, right? And then you go, oh, I don't have the capacity to do that right now, so I'll do it later. I mean, what have been the, over the last half a decade, what have been the three or four or five, I don't like the word coping mechanisms, but like frameworks or systems that you've put in place to allow you to live the way you wanna live?

- Oh, good question. - Thanks for asking, saying I ask good questions, appreciate it. - A morning routine has been the first thing. And I say a nutritionist because I'm really bad at eating. - Haven't noticed. - It's just a general statement, it's just bad in general. So I see a nutritionist and she has put me on like a fair few different supplements that are supposed to help kind of manage that chaos, but also to fuel me the things that she knows I'm not gonna fuel myself with. And then, yeah, the morning routine has been the big game changer for me.

I'm really good in the morning and then the rest of the day I'm really bad. Like I've got the morning down pat, but now I'm like, okay, what do I need to do for lunchtime and what do I need to do in the evening? Like there's so many routines that make it really easy, but ashes, I'm gonna watch this. Having a partner who is very spontaneous, very spontaneous, like, hey, let's go to the beach. And I'm like, that's not in the routine, that's wrong. We can't do that. And he's like, you gotta be spontaneous. And I'm like, yeah, but my brain doesn't want me to do that.

So having somebody in my life that kind of like makes me go outside of the routine as well is really challenging, but he's getting better. We'll give him a little bit of lenience there. - Love that. But I think that's part of it is like, is almost being able to, and I struggle with it, being able to communicate and I'm still relatively fresh in the scheme of things with it. Being able to communicate to the people in your life what you need at that time, right? Like there's, obviously there's the work conversation, there's the training conversation, there's the at-home conversation, and they're all a little bit different.

And what we need from each part of our life is different. But being able to kind of go, hey, I know consciously that even though there's this subconscious resistance, I know consciously that going to do something completely different is great, but it's being able to articulate that in your brain and it's like, hey, I know this is good. I feel resistance to it. This is why, and it's just a self-awareness play. - Totally, totally. That's it. And I think like what we are really good at, and I know that you relate to this, is constantly looking at the things we're doing and going, that's not good enough.

That's not good enough. And I think that when I got that diagnosis, it kind of gave me the opportunity to step back a little bit and go, but it's my best. And that's okay. And I think like in the partnership side of things as well, like I'm so grateful 'cause Ash is really, really great with me. - Shout out. - Yeah, go Ash, you're awesome. But I think him having that level of, what would I say it would be called? Patience, of patience with me is like, he gets frustrated obviously, but like there is that

level of patience that he had for me throughout that entire process that has helped me kind of evolve into this version of me now, which I'm grateful for 'cause he's a superstar. And if I could be anything like him, then I'd be very grateful. - That's a bump up, I love it. If you were to like, if says you've been there, I was able to have a 30 second, 60 second conversation with you five years ago, as you were getting diagnosed, what would you say? - Don't listen to anyone else. During that phase, there was

like a lot of background talk and things like that helped feed those little demons in my head that made me feel like I wasn't good enough. And I think if I could go back in time and speak to that person, it would be, don't listen to them. Like everything that you know you're capable of, you are capable of it and you will eventually prove it, but letting them take that much control over the way you're feeling isn't helping you in any way, shape or form. And these are your shoes, dude, you got to walk in them, you may as well do it properly.

- Yes, one of my favorite quotes is, "Traveler, there is no path, the path is made by walking." And essentially it just becomes a, okay, well, yes, you can listen to the psych and the doc and friends that have gone through it and all of the people that are talking shit or aren't helpful, all of these voices are just inputs. We get to choose which ones we listen to, which ones we add weight to, which ones we actually value and which ones we don't. I would imagine over the last five years, you've been able to

go not helpful, not helpful, helpful, helpful, and shift your focus to going, okay, well, what is my experience as your experience and what you've working through is super important as is the people in your life that you actually give a shit about hearing their opinions and the other people you just don't need to because it's not helpful. - Yeah, I think like my favorite thing that I say this to a lot of people, but something that I keep relaying in my head is, would I ask this person for their opinion? If I needed advice on something, could I ask them for advice?

And if the answer is no, then why the hell do I care what they think? And that's kind of something that I keep coming back to every single time is the moment that somebody gives me their unsolicited advice and I'm just like, cool. I just go straight away, but would I go to them for advice? Would I ask them for help on something? And if the answer is no, then I'm like, cool, thanks for that one. - Yeah. - See you next time. - Yeah, 'cause I think that's 'cause, and this is the thing is

like, everyone wants to help other people, but unless you have a robust understanding as to what this person is going through, where they're at, what they need, 'cause I can see here is someone's been in business a little bit longer be like, oh, here are the things I think you need. But if you are not in the head space to receive that slash, I don't understand it well enough, it's not helpful. - Yeah, totally. - But being able to create the space for you to then ask for help. And I would imagine people have come

to you as they've come to me from like an ADHD perspective, like, oh, you did this video or you did this thing or you've spoken about it. Tell me how you went through it or tell me your experience. And then they get to either choose to listen or not. So I would imagine that that aspect for you has been massive because you've done some pretty wonderful things over the last five years. - Yeah, it's been pretty cool. - It's been super cool. I've really psyched over it. - And I really want to talk about it. But if someone's looking out there and going, oh, maybe I, and here's a little sidebar.

ADHD is the only mental health condition where people actively try and recruit everyone else into our club. They're like, oh, you're pretty fun. Come hang out with us. - Makes sense. I have this theory that people with green eyes are ADHD. 'Cause every person I've met that has green eyes are ADHD. Yeah, that's my theory, but I'm not in the medical industry. - I'm here for the theory. What would you say to someone that's sitting there going, oh, like, and this doesn't have to just be from an ADHD perspective. This can be from a mental health perspective, thinking about talking to a psych or I'm feeling like I need a little bit of help.

What would your advice be to someone who's potentially in your shoes sometime over the last decade or two? - Find the money. It's expensive, but find the money. Go to the people that can help you in this path. You don't need to be medicated. You don't need to do what everyone else is telling you to do. But my suggestion would be at least get the right medical advice because there's so many things on the internet that tell us that this is what ADHD looks like. And yes, it does. But that's just like a lot of people have those kinds of - It's one lens.

There's so many different things. - You get distracted or highly stimulated in an intense stimulant environment, probably because it's stimulating. So I think that, yes, invest the money in it and find a way to do it because it is an expensive pathway. But once you have that confirmation, like I said before, it's just such a massive weight off your shoulders and you don't need to go down the medication path or anything like that. You just have that confirmation within yourself. And I think that is the most important part of the whole diagnosis process. - Yeah, 100%.

I would just say that self-awareness is a massive part of this and understanding who you are, what you need, what you value, all of these kind of things. For me, journaling was the thing that kind of allowed me to unlock the understanding but it's a tool that you can choose to use or not. And meditation from another standpoint, meditation isn't just sitting there and trying to clear your mind. It never happens, but it's actually paying attention to what's bouncing around in there. It's like you're the dude watching your thoughts, being the monkey on the tree, bouncing between limbs.

You're not the monkey. So when you actually understand that and you go, okay, well, I can look at my thoughts. I can observe my thoughts and go, I don't need to buy into the negativity or the negative self-talk or the I can't do this. You can just look at it and go, nah, it's not me. - I think as well, like something everyone kept saying to me was meditate, meditate, meditate. And for me, laying in a room and like just trying to stay still was so impossible. So finding other ways to meditate, like I used to go up my head.

That was my thing. I used to go headstands every time. And then the second thing for me was a slack line, like walking on a slack line because I just needed to zone in 100% into like what was happening there and block out everything else with different ways that I found to meditate. And I think, yeah, there's a lot of pressure. Like people, when they say meditate, they straight away think they're laying on the ground. - Sitting on a mountain going om. - Right? - Yeah. - Yeah. - So yeah. - I kind of want to do that.

That sounds really fun. - It does sound pretty fun. For about 40 seconds, I'd be like, is there anything? Well, there's a bug. But essentially like that, whether you're sitting on a mountain, whether you're going for a walk, riding bikes, like learning, doing a deadlift, doesn't really matter. - No, no, that's it. - All we're trying to do is create space to actually observe what's going on up top. And I think that's a superpower that when you can have the capacity to do that, even when you lose the capacity in certain periods of your life, when you have the capacity to come back to that, it doesn't have to be a 45-minute transcendental meditation session.

It can be five breaths where you actually exhale and go, okay, what do I need right now? I'm actually dehydrated. Or I'm actually a bit grumpy because of this. Or I haven't actually eaten today. - Absolutely. - And we start to shift back to then what we can control, which I think is a big aspect of it. And obviously this is me shifting the conversation. It's all the same shit, right? But talk me through your last few years as a business owner, coach, all of the things. How have you gotten to where you are now with, like I said before, the coolest ninja gym in the world?

- I'm really loving this marketing that you're doing for me right now, love it. - Glad movement, get around it. - So I, well, actually it was during COVID. I decided that I didn't want to stick around here for very good reason. I wasn't super keen on being locked in the house and I'd just had an ankle reco. And I was just like, I need to not be number one, injured, laying in bed the whole time. Number two, I can't leave the house. Number three, I just am so isolated right now, as we all were. So I decided to go and do a snow season for the first time because it was regional.

We were still able to work and make money. And Ash, my partner had said that he really wanted to do a snow season. He'd always wanted to do a snow season. And so I went over and I started my snow season at Hotham. And straight away, like I'm a very career orientated person, which I love, but I also hate it because it takes me away from my personal side so much. But the moment I got there, I was like, cool. I want to be the general manager. And like, I started off in a management position there.

And then from there, the following year, I approached my bosses and I just said, you need some help. Like you've got three venues. You guys are like, number one, being a head chef at the same time in one of the three. And number two, you're managing over 30 staff members. There's like a lot of things going on here. I want to step in as a general manager. So I did that for my second year at Hotham. And I did it for my third year. But in between the second and the third year, I started coaching again.

So I'd taken a massive step back from coaching because I was kind of missing life. And I felt like all of the activities that my friends and things were interested in was during my coaching hours. Like they'd go to the beach, they go snorkeling, they go like rock climbing, they go ninja training. Like they do all of these things and it was whilst I was coaching. And I felt very, I guess excluded, but not that it was their fault, my career kind of kept me back from that. - What kind of coaching were you doing for those?

- Gymnastics, yes. So I was coaching gymnastics at that point. And then when I stepped back into coaching, I started teaching cheerleading. So I was approached by a business owner who I had done tumbling coaching for them before. And she'd asked me to come in and coach cheerleading, which I'd never done before. And honestly, I was shitting myself. Like I'm pretty good with understanding biomechanics, but the moment that they put me into a sport that I was like, oh God, I've done like six months of this as an athlete and that's it. - It's different. - Like I know how to teach tumbling, but you're talking about like throwing people in the air now.

And like I did it, I loved it. It was the best thing like for me in that moment. And then I went back to do my third snow season and my Nana had just passed away. So I kind of went into this snow season. There was a couple of extra things on top of that that just made me hate it. Like I was there and I missed coaching. I felt so again, isolated. I was doing the wrong thing in my head because I didn't wanna be in hospitality forever. I love hospitality, but I didn't wanna be in it forever.

And in my ADHD brain, I had reached the peak. I had done what I had tried to achieve. - You did the thing you told yourself you wanted to do. - Right? So I came in and I managed the three venues and we did really well, like really, really well. We were like really high above our KPIs. The staff were really happy. We had like, I think it was an 80% retention rate of staff for the following year. Like all of the things that we aimed for, we got even higher than that. So for me, when I got there and I was like, I've already done this though.

I wanna coach, I wanna do this, I wanna do this. And my Nana passing and all of this stuff, I just kind of like went downhill very quickly. So I ended up deciding within the first month of me being at the snow season that I was just gonna quit and that I was gonna just enjoy the snow season and actually snowboard for the first time forever. 'Cause like when you're working like, I was doing like 70 hour weeks and there's no way to do a snow season. If you're gonna do a snow season, do not do that.

It is the worst. Like you gotta snowboard. - It's so funny 'cause you're like, I'm gonna go to the snow 'cause I love snowboarding and then you've snowboard three days. - Literally, like I would snowboard to work to check in on everyone. And then I would snowboard to the chairlift and then I'd go to the next venue. Like I was barely even there. And then I came home from the season and I was just like, I wanna open my own gym. I just, I really wanna do this. And a friend of mine was selling their space, which was massive.

And I approached them and I said, look, I wanna buy this gym. And they were like, it's really expensive. And I'm like, oh, well, I don't have any money. So what am I gonna do? And they had said to me, what about the compound, the Ninja gym in Seaford? Why don't you buy that? And I was like, well, I don't want a Ninja gym. I wanna do gymnastics. I wanna coach gymnastics and cheerleading. Like that's the path I wanna go down now. And he was just like, well, you can make it anything you want it to be.

And I was like, cool. Okay, so I had a bit of a look into it. I'm like, how am I gonna do this financially? What are we gonna do here? And I was in a really, really, really lucky position where I paid it off over 12 months. So I was in a position where every bit of money that was coming in was going straight to them so that I could just pay it all off. And I did, I paid it off in 12 months, which was hectic. Yeah, yeah. And again, shout out to Ash for paying all the rent and feeding us.

- It's like little sidebar. It's a nice reminder 'cause you've done twice you went, this is what I want and you've gone and figured it out. Which I think for most people, most young people, most young business owners, it's something you have to go through. You have to have that period. But it's also, it's like, you have to rely on the people around you as well. Like no, there's no such thing. It's complete myth of like the self-made person. Everything we have is because of the people around us and the people that support us. - Yeah, those people that just keep lifting you.

- And being able to find those allies and lean on those people and ask for help and create that support network is so beneficial because now you're a little bit further ahead and you go, oh, if someone came to me and asked for help in a way that I could help, of course you're gonna do it. So I think that that is such an important lesson of the, figure out what you want. At Hotham you went, this is how I can be valuable. This is how I can contribute to the thing. And then a couple of years on you said the word luck, which is, I don't think it's a lot of luck.

I think timing is something that's important, but the luck aspect is just like you manifested that by doing the things that got you to a point where you're like, okay, well maybe I can actually do this. - Yeah, yeah, totally, totally, yeah. I think something I'm really bad at is stopping to smell the roses. Like I'm always kind of looking for that next thing of like, okay, cool, I did that, but what's next? What's the next thing I have to achieve? And I'm really, really good at just not looking at what we've accomplished, which like

what we have accomplished in 20 months to see, like we started with 29 members on the very first day and now we're at 270, I think. - Humping. - So like in 20 months to be able to achieve that is massive and I always like tell the staff, I'm like, hey guys, like you're a part of this. This is how we built this. Like without you, this wouldn't have happened, but I'm really good at not reminding myself, which sucks. I'm trying to get better at it. - Don't worry, I'll keep asking what you're proud of. - Yeah, thanks.

- Yeah, but I think that like it's natural to be, and one of the reasons why you've been successful, why you've been able to achieve so much in so many different facets of your life over the last while is because you're constantly like, what's next? How do I improve? There's that feedback loop of like, yes, now what? Which I think is super helpful, but then I think the flip side of that is to be able to have a moment where you're like, I'm actually really appreciative of what I've done and how far I've come and how my brain works so that it's allowed me to do this.

But it's just around like building a system in for reflection. - Totally. - Like I like to think that we're always in like one of two states where more contraction, like slow down, appreciate, build, and then they're like expansion. It's like, I want more, bigger, faster kind of thing. Whereas I think there's a third state that, talking to a few friends who run businesses lately, it's like, who run family, who have families as well, kind of forces you to slow down a little bit. It's like that savoring part. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - It's like,

'cause I guarantee that GLAD will be in such so much of a better space every year if you have, and there can be moments, it can be a day or a fortnight or a week or a weekend where you go, I'm actually really able to savor what we've done. - Yeah. - Enjoy the fruits of your labor and then go, cool, let's get back to work. - Yeah, totally. And I think, yeah, I'm pretty good. Like I have my evening debrief every single night. I call my mom on the way home. - How good? - Every night.

I speak to her like three times a day, just the best. She's like my best friend. But every single night I call mom, I debrief. I go through that stuff. And it's mostly like me being like, this really annoyed me today. And this is like doing my head in. So the moment I get home, I'm like. - Exhaled. - It's done. I'm home now. I'm done. That's it. And it's a 30 minute drive. And I think, yeah, something. My mom's pretty good at pulling me up on stuff and being like, yeah, but look at what you have done.

'Cause she's a business owner as well. And she's like, no, but like stop. And she'll walk up to me while I'm coaching. Like walk up behind me and she'll just go, look down the gym. And I'm like, what? And she's like, look what you created. I'm like, thanks mom. - It was pretty cool. 'Cause you're like, okay, I want a thing. You had an idea and you've relentlessly executed on that with mistakes, I'm sure. With things that have gone wild, things that haven't. You know, like the fact that it's only 20 months old, it's wild. - It feels like it's like 10 years old, to be honest.

Like I've invested so much energy into it. Like every second of every day that it's like, that can't have been 20 months. - Yeah, I think there's something to be said of like, the hours you would have done. It's like the throwaway line I use for the years. Virtus was like, it's gone so fast, but so much has happened. - Yes, so much. 'Cause there's always that like next day, next day, next day, next session, next thing that you're chasing, but being able to go, okay, we're actually moving the needle and making progress. And part of that's just the people you surround yourself with like your mom, Ash, your staff now.

Now you're in this like, okay, well I need to, I imagine so much of it's up here. You need to build systems and a team that can then deliver on the things that you think of. I imagine that's probably the next part of your journey. - Yeah. - Enjoy that intermission. Sorry about the, sorry about the, we might have lost a couple of minutes of video, but that's okay. You guys will just enjoy a picture of us doing these ones. So we're chatting about work, we're chatting about the gym. Talk us through like when you bought it, obviously massive thing, what was the initial plan?

How has that evolved and changed over the last 20 months? - I think what I went into it expecting was very different to what it actually became. I obviously went into it with the idea that I wanted a gymnastics gym, gymnastics and cheerleading. And Ninja is not that. Like, yes, there are those elements, those like fundamental movements. Yeah, like those fundamental movements kind of like intersect from the gymnastics world into it. But yeah, it was really different and it wasn't until I was in that space and I met my community and I met all of these kids that I was coaching that I realized my initial plan was too vanilla, like way too vanilla.

And I think something that I really enjoy doing is, this is so bad, but I really enjoy winging it. I really enjoy just like getting to it and going, okay, cool, now what's this gonna become? - Yeah, I think there's a massive amount of value in the ignorance that comes with that because it's like, it's, you know, I call it like our youthful ignorance phase of Virtus when we just like, I didn't know you had to get council permission for things. I didn't know you had to do this. I don't know, you just pull the trigger and you throw shit at the wall and you go, okay, this is what sticks.

- And where are all the people gonna park for every hour that you have another 30 people coming through? - I know. But these are the things that you like figure out as you go. Like, we used to have the saying, it's like a perfect plan executed next week, sorry, I always butcher this every fucking time. - It's all right, we'll forgive you. - An imperfect plan executed, violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed sometime in the future, right? Because you can go, oh, this actually doesn't work or this does work or,

you know, and you end up being able to just like, not make shit up as you go, but fix and tweak and change and iterate and reiterate as you go. - Well, they're all lessons, right? - Exactly, exactly. And when you do it from a place of like, like you're not in it to do a, you know, a nine to five, three days a week, right? You're there to be like, I'm gonna live and breathe this thing for as long as I need to until someone in my life says, dude, you really should just like work a little bit less.

- Yeah, they always say it to me and I think they're the crazy ones, not me. - But I would agree, right? But then like right now, that's your priority, that's your number one thing, that's the thing that you're building. And I think that's why to this point it's been successful. Now you're in this like, okay, I need, I can't do this forever this way. Now you're in the, okay, well, I've got to shift away from that. Similar to the ADHD stuff, it's like, I've got to build systems, I've got to build competencies in my team, I've got to be able to have people who aren't me deliver it the same way or better ideally than I would.

So what's that headspace shifts being mindset shifts? Obviously it's not a one day you go, I need someone else to do all this, but it's like, I imagine it would be an evolution. - Yeah, so next year we're actually, one of the young girls I used to coach at Peninsula Gymnastics when I first opened, contacted me and said, hey, I want to learn from you. - Amazing. - And I was like, hell yeah you do because I don't have any of the coaches right now and this is such a niche sport that please, yes. And she came in like a couple of months from when we opened and next year she's going to be stepping into full-time work with us.

So my big thing, especially, I haven't really spoken about this yet, but I worked for Peninsula Gymnastics for a really long time or not a really long time, I think it was like six years. - That's a long time. - It is and it was my favourite place I've ever worked. The crew in there were just incredible. They helped me again, evolve into this person. I met Ash through the gym, all of this stuff and I've forgotten where I was going with that. - Well, I've got a question for you. Why was it your favourite place you ever worked?

What about it made it somewhere where you're like, I have that memory even though you're not there anymore? - Because they cared. Like the thing that they did differently to everywhere else that I've ever worked is they saw you as a person. And even though they obviously have bills to pay, you have a job to do, they have all of these things. They were the kind of people that if you were having a shit day, they were going to look out for you first and if there was a customer that came in that said that you did a really bad job, they backed you 100% the whole way.

They paid for your education and in this world, a lot of people don't understand that coaches in most sports don't get paid to go to competitions. So especially in the gymnastics world, when I stepped away from competitive gymnastics and went to Peninsula gymnastics, they immediately were like, yeah, so if you're coming to this competition on Sunday, which you're going to do a 10 hour day, 12 hour day, we're going to put that as time in lieu. And then if you have something else that you want to do on a certain weekend, you put it in and that's where like that goes.

And for me, that was a really big eye-opener 'cause they were paying for my gymnastics Australia registration. They were paying for all of my education. Like the moment I said, I want to go into a course, they're like, $800, go for it. - Yeah, that's cool. - Like they really just supported and backed their team. And I have tried really hard to do a similar thing. - Which is so hard as a business owner, right? You're like, oh, I've got these ideas of what I want to do. And then you're like, oh shit, the money doesn't make sense.

But it's like, essentially, if you can keep layering on that, building on that, then you end up building these systems that it might not look exactly the same as that, but at least you go, well, the values or the key aspects of this I'm delivering on in a similar way. - Yeah, and I'm really lucky as well 'cause both Beck and Tim are both mentors of mine. - Shout out. - Yeah, go Beck and Tim, you're the best. But they're both still mentors and I still will pick up the phone and go, hey, I have this thing, what would you do?

Or like a conversation that I had with Tim a couple of months ago was in this position, what would you have done differently? 'Cause I know you've dealt with this before. So I want to know what you would have done differently if you could redo it. And honestly, his answers were like, I wouldn't do anything differently. All of it was a lesson. Everything I did was for a reason. And in that moment, it was exactly accurate of how I was feeling and what I needed to do. And honestly, they're the best, I couldn't. - That's so cool.

'Cause having those people in your life as a business owner, it's so beneficial 'cause I'm a big believer that every business owner should have a coach, like every athlete should have coaches and we should have people that we lean on, but just being able to talk to someone that's maybe five, 10, 15 years, six months ahead in a shape or form, like same with the ADHD stuff. It's like, tell me about your experience and tell me about, hey, I love the question. It's like, not what should I do, but what would you do if you were in my shoes?

'Cause sometimes it's a different answer. And being able to get that feedback, I would imagine in some difficult times because business is hard, just pay your taxes. - I'm pretty good at that. - Good, yeah. Just makes, it allows you to go, oh, I'm actually on the right path. I'm actually doing okay, because I think the biggest thing as a solo business owner, yes, you've team and you've got people around you, is like, it's a lonely place if you let it be. But if you actually create the space to ask for help, like I said before, everyone, I would like to think, everyone, when given the opportunity, wants to help everyone around.

- Yeah, yeah, that's it, that's it. - It's my radical view on the world is everyone actually wants to give a shit about each other. - Yeah, and I think like we don't need to be competitors. Like as business owners, even if we do have the same target audience and we do have like similar like services and things, I think we don't need to be direct competitors in a negative way. Like we can still be competitors, but in a way where it's positive and we can still help each other out. Like there might be a kid in my program that doesn't like my program.

- That fits better in this. - But I still want that child to be able to move somewhere. I want them to do something. So, okay, cool, this is where I suggest that you should try next and see if that's your right spot. Because I think there's a lot of ego from the gymnastics world, I can't say from a lot of other places, but from the gymnastics world, there's a lot of ego based around, but I'm the best. I'm the best, you shouldn't want to go anywhere else. And I think that especially like this new

generation of people coming through in sport and recreation and in the fitness world, being able to build a more positive approach that we do what we do because we care. - Yes. - We don't do this because like, well, I don't. - No one gets into the fitness industry or the coaching industry to make bank, unfortunately. - Right? - If only it could be both, but it ain't, so we carry on. - Like we're passionate people. We want to see people strive in their own environments and what they're doing. And like, I personally love watching that growth.

And I'm pretty lucky because I get to see from like when they're one and then I get to keep watching them grow physically, mentally, socially, everything. And for me, that's why I really do what I do. - Yes. - And then on top of that, I really love biomechanics. - It's kind of fun to watch bodies do cool shit. But I think like I'd reflect that from a fitness industry perspective, obviously very adjacent industries. And one of the things I try and say, and I try and communicate like to our community and further is there's no such thing as competition in the fitness industry, right?

- Yeah. - Because, and I truly believe this, everyone run like, and the way our gym runs, it's very different to like, I don't know a gym that runs a model like this, which rightly or wrongly, it's worked so far. But we're not competing against the anytime fitnesses, the jets, the habits, the, what are they called? Fuck, shit, no, body change. What are they used to doing there now? Bootcamp, anyway, something, something, something. Base camp, base camp. Like I look at these guys, I'm like, oh, they're all doing a really cool thing. The rebels of the world, get around Jackie.

These, they're all doing really cool things in their own way, right? I don't want to be those gyms. - I know that's right. - Like for me, I run the gym the way I think it should run. We coach the way we should coach. But if someone fits into one of their systems better, if one of our members goes, I actually want to do this kind of training or I want to do this, I'll be the first to be like, go to have fun. Because like, we don't want to keep people who don't, who aren't vibing with what's important.

And the competition aspect of it is like, the more gyms in Mornington that are doing well, the better for us. Because then we get to do what we do, which is just be us, be us, deliver it in the way we want. We're competing, and if there is competition in the fitness industry or the gymnastics injury, we're competing against the 83% of people that don't have a gym membership. - That's right. - We're not competing with, you know, the gyms around. It's like, you know, there's a lot of people between here and Cananook, Seaford, Cananook? - Seaford, yeah.

- Seaford? - Yeah. - Seaford, where GLAD is, you guys only need, what'd you say before, 274. So you guys, if you had 300 people, you'd be like, we're thriving. - Yeah. - Yeah. - There are what, 60,000 people between here and Frankston, ish, quick maths. So yeah, the competition side of things, I think, a rising tide lifts all boats. We should be collaborating as industries. - 100%. - Gymnastics, ninja, cheer, fitness, S&C, you know. Like, yeah, other people do things that maybe you wouldn't do the way that they do it, but this is the whole point.

It's like, be an individual business. Do what makes you happy. - Yeah. - What you think is important. - Totally. - Listen to what the market wants, but also, like, if you can go to work every day going, I'm running this exactly the way that I think it should be run, I might be wrong, but you get to figure it out as you go and make little tweaks and changes and things like that. - Yeah, and I think that's really powerful as well, like being in complete control of how you want things to look and be, and for me, I didn't realise that we were kind of gonna target a lot of the neuro spicy kids.

I didn't realise how much this sport really was attractive to those kind of people. - There's an element of who you are, being reflected in the business you're trying to build, right? Like, you wanna create a safe space for kids that maybe, you know, aren't fitting into the regular system to be able to, you know, create a place where they can come and be, you know, like, unapologetically themselves, to be able to express who they are, express what they're figuring out, to learn from someone that's been where they are. - Yeah. - And I would

imagine that your journey as an athlete to then being a coach has been the thing that's allowed you to create this space where the kids and the people that you coach, they just wanna be. - Yeah, totally. I think like as an athlete and kind of going into this space for me as a young kid, I was so misunderstood, like so misunderstood. I wasn't talking over the top of everyone all the time because I wanted to be rude. I was talking 'cause I had something to say, and it wasn't that I wanted to interrupt somebody or like I wasn't standing on my head because I wasn't interested in what you were saying.

It was the only way I was able to focus on what you were saying. And I think kind of the moment that I saw all of these kids in this space, because I didn't realise this is what it was gonna be, but the moment I saw everyone in this space, I remembered what it was like, and I remember always feeling really guilty that I wasn't doing a good enough job to pay attention and to like be engaged and all of these things. And then I stopped and I was like, hang on, if these kids need to stand on their head while I'm talking to them, why can't they?

Like what's the big deal? And I remember like it was only in the last six months that I've really, really thought about this, but as an athlete, I really wonder what it would have been like for me if I had a coach that understood what was happening. And not that like when we were kids, nobody knew what was happening. Nobody knew what the hell was going on with this ADHD kid that's running around, climbing on the roof and doing all of this like really whack stuff. So a part of that also is like the forgiveness

and understanding that like it was nobody's fault that they didn't have that level of education, but what can I do right now to be able to help the next generation of athletes who are neuro spicy and probably the most talented kids that are in there actually achieve what they want to achieve because like it's hard, like we have kids that come in that their parents, they've had like, let's say hypothetically, a suspension from school. They take everything else away from them as a punishment, but they're still allowed to go to Ninja because it is the most positive thing in their life where they can still be themselves.

And in that situation, I would be very, very grateful to know that that kid is so comfortable and is so themselves in our space that for them, they're like, if you take Ninja away from me, that is the worst thing you could do ever. - Because I think there's so many layers and like we've lent harder on the junior aspect of it. Like we've, the cool thing about being open so long is we've seen athletes like you develop so much and become like fully hit, fully fledged adults who I look up to in a massive amount.

But we've had kids that have, we have the odd kid over the last three or four or five or six years, but now we've had a massive influx this year because it's like, holy shit, we get to learn movement competency, we get to learn like self-confidence, we get to learn leadership skills. Like the parents bring them in for the training, but I think the thing that they walk out with every session is like they get to communicate with 20 different people who aren't their age, not their sport, they're talking to different, interacting with different coaches and different staff and things like that.

- And kids need that exposure. - They're exploring what they're actually capable of, but they're building this level of capability and confidence that they don't get anywhere else, right? A lot of these kids, like you said, they're at school, they're told that, you know, to sit down, shut up, to, you know, they're not able to express themselves and whether they're a physical kid or not doesn't necessarily matter because they're doing it in a way that's, challenges them where they're at. I would imagine with GLAAD I took the girls there early days, I really need to bring them back because- - You do, it's changed a lot.

- Plus too, 276 as of next year, we'll work that out. But I think then it creates this space for the kids to be able to like, oh, I can express who I am, I can move my body and learn what I'm capable of and then I can learn the work ethic and capacity to keep showing up. I have coaches that give a shit and understand who I am and then I get to do it in a space with my peers where like we're all cheering each other and getting around each other and celebrating and doing all these things.

So big props to the environment you created and I think being able to look back and go, this is exactly what I needed as an athlete is like, is such a cool thing to be able to do. - Yeah, yeah, and I didn't even realise that that's what I wanted to do until it started and that I saw all of these kids and I was like, huh, okay, we're gonna change this completely, whole new direction, let's go for it. - But that's the cool thing about being the one that's driving it is you go, you know what?

I don't think this is the best way but here's what I'm gonna do now. And I would imagine the evolution every time you transcend and loop back around, it's like it changes slightly. The goalposts move but the direction stays the same. It's like, how do we continue to move the needle forward? Like I look at this space and you've been able to experience as an athlete to be able to see the differences in the way we coach, how we deliver it and all of these different changes. But ultimately, the initial reason why it was the way it was was because of what I experienced at a VFL level.

I was like, oh, this is so cool having all of these people who are here for my growth and my development. I get to do it in a group. Everyone's like, the vibe's high, we're all moving together but I get my own thing to work on with the collective thing. And I think that the way we deliver that has changed astronomically over 11 years but the thing that stays the same is like the values and the importance of developing, like you were saying before with Mornington, which was the-- - Peninsula. - Peninsula. - Yeah. - It's like human first, athlete second.

It's like, how do we build lifelong capacity? That's what we're here for. - That's right, that's right. And I think, yeah, like for here in particular, I've actually really enjoyed watching how everything has changed over this. I think I started in 2016, 2015, 2016. - That's crazy. - And like being able to see it, like even us having to train outside during COVID, like those days. - Thanks for the flashbacks. - Do not miss that. But like being able to see and like see the community that kind of come in and like they then go out and then there's more that come in and then they leave and they come back like me.

- And it's simultaneously the best and the worst part of our job, right? Is like when people leave and I don't take it as personally as I used to, but like I used to take it so personally. - Yeah. - But now like a little bit more evolved now, I think. Being able to look and go, oh, we played a part of someone's journey, whether it was a month, six months, five years, 10, like it doesn't really matter. If every time someone walked in here, they were able to look on the wall and say better every day and go, you know, I moved the needle today.

I did a thing, I learned a thing. I connected with someone. And if someone's able to continually doing that, continually do that over a period of time, they can take that out to the world and influence another gym or influence other people or influence their athletes and do it in a way where it's conducive to making the world a better place, which ultimately I think that's why people become coaches is because they go, I can add value to someone's life, whether it be technical skills, whether it be tactical, whether it be leadership, whether it be growth.

And then the cool thing is, is when people land, you know, you bounce around snow seasons for years, you're doing all these other things. We'd see you for a month or two or six months and you go away for the season. And now I can look at you like someone like you and you know, this is one of the strengths of Virtus is when it's right again, when you're like, okay, I need to start looking after myself, you can shoot me a text and we can, hey, I'll just jump on a 40 second phone call with you and we just talk for 45 minutes around like, around what you're doing and how we can help and those kinds of things.

And yeah, I'm super excited to see you go through the same thing as a business owner to be able to see people loop back in as more evolved, more capable versions of themselves. - Yeah, yeah. I'm excited as well. Like I now, I kind of feel like, again, like what I said before that I've reached like that goal and not that I'm bored of it, but now I need to create another goal and another like stepping stone or another milestone for me to get to in order for me to get that dopamine fix. Like I've got to like, 'cause I'm at the point now where I'm like sitting on my computer and I'm like, what do I need to do?

It's a super weird feeling, but it's something like, I resonate with that so strongly. - Yeah. - For me, like there's been different chapters and iterations of Virtus, right? - Yeah. - When they got to a point where like, I've got a thing, I took a photo the other day of like 2021 goals or something that were just on a thing. And I'm like, holy shit, I've ticked all those off. But for a couple of years, I went, I've kind of achieved everything I set out to. All I needed to do was like reiterate what winning looked like now, what I need to do now and what moving forward.

Whereas like, I kind of had like, not in a bad thing. It was almost that like savoring without realizing that that's what I was doing. But it's almost that sitting in it in purgatory in terms of like, oh, well, I'm just kind of coasting because things are okay. They're not brilliant, but they're not bad. - Yeah. - And it was almost like having those few years, I ended up focusing on spending more time with the girls and things like that. Now we're getting out of that phase for me where I'm like, okay, I'm really clear on where growth looks like for Virtus in 2026 and 2027.

And moving forward from there, I know where my growth lies. I know where the space for our team to grow is. And then you kind of get this second wind or third wind or however, I've had many wins over the years, but it's like, all right, now I know what I need to do, but it just, I wish it didn't take me three years to figure that head space, but it takes as long as you need. - Yeah, I figured it out. I know what I'm doing. - Yeah, I think when you can re almost like achieve the thing and this goes for any endeavor, whether it be like, I'm gonna run a marathon.

So you do a 10K, you do a 21K, you do a six month training block and then you run a marathon. You're like, oh fuck, now what do I do with the rest of my life? - Yeah. - When we can go, all right, well, what do I actually want my life to look like? - Yeah. - It's values, beliefs, orientated. The actions are just the thing that you do to get there. - Yeah. - Then it's like, okay, well, you have a really clear goal now. - Yeah. - I would imagine versus when you started of like, this is what I want my life to look like.

How you get there, who knows, but at least the next step or two in front of you to move forward. - And it's honestly been the best thing that I've ever done for myself. Like I've always wanted to own a gym that has been like, I think I was 14 in business class. - I'm gonna run a gym. - And I was like, they're like, you need to put together a business plan. And I'm like, yeah, it'll be a gymnastics gym. And they're like, why don't you look outside of gymnastics and say like, that's not the best path for you to take.

You're not gonna make a lot of money. And I'm like, yeah, that's what I like doing. And like, I always knew I was gonna have a gym. And then the moment I got into it, I was like, okay, cool. I found who I am now. Like I pushed it away because I wanted to do those social things. And I wanted to explore different career pathways and do all of this other stuff. But the moment that I was in it, I was like, okay, cool. We're there now. I know who I am now. I know my purpose.

I know what I'm passionate about. And it really did like, did you ask me before what gets me out of bed? Or was that before? - No, I didn't. I said I was gonna maybe ask you at the start, but what, you know, this is not a bad way. I've got a couple of questions to maybe wrap it up 'cause otherwise we'll talk forever. What does get you out of bed in the morning? - Now I know, now I know. The thing that gets me out of bed in the morning is my passion and my drive for my career.

But it's also my alarm. (laughs) - Fundamentally, that's driven by the love for gymnastics that you fostered when you were younger, right? Like I think the cool thing about, that I think about your story is like, you didn't, and this is every successful person I think, you know, success asterisk winning achievement. Use whatever word you wanna use 'cause I think everyone's successful in their own way. But if you ask anyone who's doing a thing, whether it be someone that's running a cafe or, you know, a big business or a small business, doesn't matter. If you ask them what success looked like at the start versus now, it changes astronomically, right?

And you, it didn't look the way you'd planned. You know, you went the ninja route into adding cheer and gym and all of these kind of things to it. But it allows you to like get to know yourself. It gets to know what's really important. I think fundamentally, like I love this place because of the growth and development and space. It allows people to hold to do those things, right? The thing for you as gymnastics, that was the thing that got it going. But ultimately the big thing that keeps it going, that's part of it. It's not the whole picture.

- Yeah, totally. - And you almost need the thing to get you going. But you know, the more you can reflect and build self-awareness and understand what's important to you and what you need and what your values are and all of these kind of things, the more you go, oh, well, that thing that got me going isn't the thing that got me here. - Yeah. - But now this new thing is going to keep me going forever. - Yeah, yeah, totally. And I think gymnastics was a really good thing to teach me those kinds of life skills as well.

I mean, obviously it's very systematic in the sense that you've got to work for a certain skill. You've got to do this, this, this, and this. And then even then, they're still going to tell you it's not perfect. You put on that leotard and you put on a smile and you get up there and you compete it. And then they're still like, yeah, it's not good enough. - But that's almost the beauty of the pursuit. It's like everything we do, we want to have built-in feedback mechanisms for here's the RFI, here's the room for improvement for the next time.

And whether it be hospitality, general managing, gym, like all of these things allow you, all of these experiences have allowed you to build transferable skills to do what you're doing now. There's still gaps and there's still like room for improvement, but you can look at the way you run the gym now and I reckon you'd be able to reflect on a handful of things you learned at Hotham that allowed you to better deliver the service you have to run, right? - SOPs, right? - Shout out. - SOPs. - Shout out. Have you used those ones I sent you?

Anyway, conversation from another day. But I think the, like, you know, we had a bunch of year 12s finished last week and I put a post up and had a few responses which was really nice, but it was like, you don't need a fixed system to tell you how wonderful you are. What you need is to go, this is my thing that I did, reflect on it, am I proud of it, am I not? Did I do enough work, did I not? You know, these answers don't matter. What we do next matters 'cause in everything

you do, whether you're in the job you love, in a job you hate, it tightens your awareness around what's important, what you wanna be doing. We build transferable skills and we just carry on and keep moving forward. - Well, that's it, that's it. - If you land in something you love doing, like I would imagine you had it, like you said, you had a period of time where you weren't in it, like you'll get there, it just takes time. - Yeah, that's it. And I think, yeah, at the very like start of adulthood, I was like, I'm gonna open my own gym right now.

And then I went and worked in a few different places and I was like, no, I'm not ready yet. I wanna go and learn from more people first. And like a lot of people were very pushy on me doing that at the start, like when I was 19. And they're like, you go and open your own gym, go and open your own gym, like you've got it, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then I was like, no, I'm too young, I need to learn more. I need to go out there. Like I think I know everything right now and that's the thing that's gonna hold me back.

And I'm so grateful I didn't do it then and there because I don't think the gym that I would have started then would be open right now. - But that's a really important thing to be able to reflect on, right? Like I would, I'd challenge that in a way, not necessarily that it's right or wrong, but like if you did it then, you probably would have figured it out. And you'd be at like the gym, if you were running, still running a gym now, if you did something different, you'd still be in the right place where you needed to be.

It just would have looked different. And I think that's the cool thing of like, whether you want to open a gym when you're 40 or 20, it doesn't really matter. Or whether you want to do a coffee shop or quit your job, it doesn't matter when you do it, but when you do pull the trigger, it's like, all in, how do I learn? How do I have feedback loops? How do I lean on people around me? And how do I move it forward in a way that is genuinely authentically you? Which I think GLAD is, so, bravo.

- Do you want me to segue to the athlete thing? What athlete thing? - The thing you want to talk to me about athlete? - No, we already covered that. We covered the athlete stuff. Two questions for you. - Go, shoot. - What are you most proud of? - I'm most proud of my self development. How far I've come as a person and how much I've accepted myself for who I am, because there are a lot of talking back here that tried to make me not me. - In your head or someone else? - Other people, yeah, yeah.

And I'm glad that I didn't let that come through. - Yeah, I like that, that's really cool. What are you most excited for? - I don't know if I'm allowed to tell you. I'm most excited for-- - Talking riddles. - Just nonsense, that doesn't sound like me. I'm most excited for the future of GLAD Movement and the different services that we are gonna be able to offer people that aren't just athletes. - Love. - Yep. - Great, everyone's an athlete. We'll just have different events. CZB, it's been an absolute pleasure. I'm super proud of you. I'm very excited to see what GLAD does.

I'm very excited for you to train regularly and look after yourself and eat enough and all of the things. - Working on it. I've got some accountability over here. - How do people find out about your wonderful gym? How do people get involved? - You can head to glabmovement.com. Otherwise we are in CFED. We're really bad at responding to emails. We're trying to get better at that, but the neuro spicy in us makes it a little bit tricky. So yeah, shoot us an email, head straight to the website. You can book any free trials or have a look at our classes and offering and things like that too.

So please, yeah, just don't be too grumpy when we don't get back to you straight away. - Just do the double follow-up email. That's super helpful. - Yes, please, please. Thank you. - Love your work. Have a good day!