S1E81 · Brooke Holmes: To be seen & understood

Hey superstars, welcome to the Virtus Performance Podcast. We have an epic episode for you guys today so I will keep this short and sweet. Couldn't you please leave us a review, load up on a 5 star review for us, tell us why you enjoy the podcast, what you got out of it, that would be spectacular. If you have any negative reviews and you haven't liked it, let me know, give me some feedback, I would love to figure out how I can make this a better listening experience for you. Before we actually get into the episode,

I'd like to thank today's guest Brooke Holmes, she's a wonderful human being and someone who has transformed her life over the last couple of years and become an integral part in many different communities and I think you guys are going to get a lot out of this episode in terms of belonging and understanding and being seen was a big theme but Brooke's been through some pretty hectic times, some harrowing times and for us to be able to sit here and have this conversation is a testament to the kind of person she is and is becoming. Let's get stuck straight in.

My personal and business goal is to be just a little bit better every day. I believe everyone, especially normal people have a story to tell. The Virtus podcast exists to help us all find small ways of consistent improvement by discussing the journey and experiences of each of our guests. Brooke, welcome to the podcast. Thanks Lucky, good to be here. This is what? Five months in the making. Something like that. It's been a while. I know, it has. It has. First question for you before we start diving into everything that is everything. What gets you out of bed in the morning?

Yeah, what gets me out of bed in the morning. You know what? I think the answer has probably changed a lot over the last couple of years, but I think if I can be very vague and then be more granular, purpose, I think we all need to have something that's purposeful, if our lives are just about us, in my case anyway, it can lead to your life being a bit sad, but I think once you can connect your life to something else or someone else or a higher purpose, it makes it so much easier to get out of bed in the morning.

And for me, I think at the moment, my last purpose is to know people and to be known. So community is a really significant part of what gets me out of bed at the moment. Has that always been the way? Has it always been you or is it something that you've developed over the last few years? I think I'd like to think of myself as a people person, but I would say I'm probably like borderline introvert/extrovert, but people have always mattered to me, but I think the way that they've mattered has changed. So I would

say that most of my teens and probably early 20s, it was more about what you can gain from relationships, how relationships make you feel, but I would say, yeah, my mid to late 20s have been really significant change in how I view the commodity of what relationships are. And that's been probably one of the significant things in my life thus far. That's cool. And what it was like going through that process and how mindset and feelings differ now compared to then. Yeah, cool. Jumping straight in. Oh yeah. This is awesome. So my mid 20s, as I said, a lot of my late teens to early 20s was about me.

It was about what made me feel good, what could I get out of life, how can I make things awesome for me, which was really awesome when things are going well, but when things are kind of stripped away and you've not necessarily got any of that or people aren't making you feel good or your job's not making you feel good or status isn't making you feel good, what's left? What's the substance that's left? Yeah. And it wasn't until about my mid 20s where, yeah, a few things kind of went wrong in life went a bit not to plan and so like a couple of relationships went pretty bad.

I wasn't doing super well just emotionally, wasn't feeling good about myself, and there's a whole bunch of other situations that led to me being pretty anxious and pretty depressed, which kind of led to a massive breakdown in about, I think it was 2015, 2016, I had a massive breakdown where I literally didn't get out of bed for like a week, had to have a significant time off work, and if I can be brutally honest, didn't want to live anymore. Life was pretty grim and I think there's a whole lot of reasons that led to that

moment, but one of them was being really self-absorbed in life being about me and what I was doing or not doing or gaining or not gaining and when your focus is so much on yourself it can be a pretty sad thing. So yeah, I was super super depressed, really anxious, there were days where I would struggle to get out of bed and even if I did get out of bed, I'd be exhausted after having a shower. We'd get ready to go somewhere, get in the car, there was one day I remember driving, I had something

on in the city, I got pretty much to Chapel Street and then had a massive panic attack in the car because I couldn't find a car park and drove all the way back. So I wasn't in a good way and anyone that's close to me that was a friend during that time would vouch for how terrible and selfish and really sad I was. This might be a weird question, but do you look back on that time and those struggles and all the stuff you went through, do you look back on it fondly? Look the time itself was horrific, it was horrific for me, it was horrific for my family.

I remember having a really awful conversation with my mum and dad. So my mum and dad have already lost a daughter and I had a sister that passed away three months old through Sid's cot death so everyone get around Red Nose Day in June. So they'd already lost a daughter and then when I came and kind of had a conversation with them was like I'm not okay and this is what I'm feeling, I don't want to exist anymore. That's really significant for a parent to hear. What made you want to have that conversation or what made you actually have that conversation?

Was it just like something internal saying I need help? I think for me it's, it was not that I didn't want to live anymore, I just didn't know how to, or how to do it well or in a way that was fulfilling or life-giving or meaningful. And as much as I would say that during that time I was suicidal there was only one particular night where I was like yep this is it. And I think for me having that conversation with, and I had it with my parents and probably one other person, having that conversation

was a way of me going like this is bad I need you to know that it's bad but also yeah that not that cry for help because it was never about wanting to be saved it was about having someone know the depths of the despair that I was in at the time and someone that could keep an eye out and keep me accountable and love me through that because I think that's one of the biggest things right you feel for me anyway I felt so alone and so unlovable and your brain is such a powerful

thing that plays so many tricks on you it's like it's gonna tell you all the worst things about yourself especially when you're in those times of despair that yeah. Especially when you're by yourself you get into that I guess downward spiral and it takes that conversation or at least that little bit of sharing with someone to stop that or at least pause it slow it down. Also someone that can bring truth for me truth was so skewed like my truth was so far from actual reality that I needed someone that can call me out on

my bullshit for me I really value those people and this is probably again from that moment but I really value the people that can be like Brooke like get your shit together and call me out on it because I can go down a tangent and a path that's really awful but having those people was such a valuable thing for me. It sounds like a pretty hectic time and I think so much of our society and so many different people go through things like that to varying degrees and and to different levels what if you could

articulate some way what it was like to go like to have that panic attack in the car for people that haven't experienced it or know someone that has experienced it but isn't able to articulate to them it's obviously a couple of years down the road and you're in a much better place now which you know is a cool I guess little reflection point to be able to stop and you know we'll talk about what you've done the last few months in a minute but what advice slash how can you articulate what it actually felt like?

It's actually I find it really hard and I've watched a bunch of YouTube videos of like people experiencing a panic attack or an anxiety attack or someone trying to like show visually what it looks like I find it really hard to articulate because it is so irrational it makes no sense and the worst bit is you know in your brain that it's completely irrational yeah but you can't you can't combat that you can't in the moment I couldn't change that thought pattern for me it was just like physically it was like my heart was beating

out of my chest like all the time I just I felt I felt like people were watching me all the time I felt very exposed and very vulnerable but not you know not in the good way just in the way that was like people could see how much I was struggling and then your brain is like as we said telling you all the things that are terrible about you that are bad about you that you know all of that kind of stuff it's it's it's so hard because you again you know how irrational it all

is and you know that most of your thoughts and and your thought patterns are false and it's not reality but you can't change it and I just yeah it was just such a significant time of just feeling so alone knowing that other people experiencing it but yeah just feeling really alone in the middle of it too because you also don't want to burden other people with how you're feeling and so for me and my friends I didn't want to be the sad person in the friendship group I didn't want to be you know the person

that it's all about them or it's it's yeah and so I that made me withdraw but when I withdrew from a community that loved and cared for me I would get worse and it's just an awful spiral there were days where like I couldn't be around my friends but yeah I have such an incredible friendship group that they would just come into my house and just sit like we didn't have to have a conversation I didn't want to have a conversation and if I'm honest with you I probably didn't even want them there but they

knew what I needed not not what I wanted it can be two different things exactly what advice would you have for someone going through that yeah or you know that feel like they're starting to go down that path especially around the withdrawing from friendship groups and not wanting to be a burden because I think that's one of I don't know if misconceptions the right way but it's one of those areas where you're not the first person that's articulated like that to me it's just I don't want to be a burden because I think we forget

how much people care sometimes and how readily available they are to you know shoulder that burden so I guess what advice would you have for someone going through that I mean it's it's really simple it's just you you need to be able to talk to someone and I'm not saying that you grab your whole friendship group and you tell them exactly where you're at you give them everything but sometimes it's just a conversation to say hey I'm struggling I'm not myself at the moment I just need you to know that and and you know check

in with me every now and then for me there was a whole bunch of ways that I kind of got out of that space and it was probably one of the most significant ways was being in nature so for me I find what I connect to it was as simple as like going to the beach and I get in my car drive to the beach and be exhausted by the time I got there but I would just sit on the sand or put my feet in the water and just would feel not everything was okay

it wasn't fixed by putting my feet in the water I'm not not saying that at all but it made it took it took my mind from a space of chaos and into a space of peace for just a moment and as I continued that that was really significant for me the other thing was having an attitude of gratitude which who doesn't love alliteration and cheesy cheesy little quotes but for me that was one of the most significant things when I started to take my eyes off how I felt my current situation what I didn't have

what I didn't achieve and started to look to the things that I did have and with an attitude of thankfulness that's when my mindset started to really change and I started to experience freedom from the things that were really shackling me and giving me anxiety but yeah if you are someone that's um yeah experiencing depression or anxiety um having a community or at least a person that you can kind of be with and be honest with is really significant what was the process like and this is a super ambiguous question so take whichever way you

want but what was the process like going from being stuck in bed for a week to this smiling bubbly person I see sitting in front of me I honestly feel like a completely different person so it's it's really easy for me to like some people are like oh wow like you're really vulnerable and brave to talk about you know suicide and depression and anxiety and I'm like you know I feel so separate to who that person was in 2016 but it's actually really easy for me to talk about yeah which is which is a really

powerful thing because 2016 scheme of things wasn't that long ago really really close like oh I don't know I feel really grateful anyway a lot's happened in that time but um one of the most significant things was probably in that um the area of community and just being able to focus on something that isn't myself like I yeah I had a really significant trip planned for um 20 end of 2016 2017 I think it was um yeah end of 2016 and that all fell through for a whole bunch of different reasons which was really devastating

for me so it was like I experienced this awful time of like depression and anxiety and then had this awesome trip planned where I was doing you know America and Canada um and it was like almost pinning my hopes to this thing um and it fell through so I was like that was a point where I could have either gone back to that place or gone nope like I'm using this and I'm moving forward and I'm moving on and because that trip fell through um that allowed me the opportunity to actually go on a different

trip um to Kenya in 2017 um which was again probably the start of the next part of the the journey for me but um yeah it was during that time of how'd that come about was there a a moment when trip one fell through and like I don't know if you can pinpoint the moment but where you kind of remember sitting thinking oh shit do I react this way or do I react this way like how did all that come about yeah really significant so for it was almost like that moment um and I I

knew in myself I knew that I could um allow my emotions and my fears to take over or I could be like nope not today like it's not happening um stick my feet in the ground and be like onward and upward to better things and allow this to be something that doesn't break me um because I think yeah resilience is such a significant part of of being okay and even when you're not okay having that having resilience means that you'll never be broken you'll never be defeated by the things and the obstacles that come your

way um so it was it was a significant moment of going nah I'm not going to be broken by this it's a thing that's happened in my life and it sucks but um no it's not going to defeat me and it obviously means that there's something better along the way um or something new or different for me yeah do you think happiness is a choice I think it is yeah so I would say so happiness I feel like is such a um like a fleeting emotion for me I want to live a life of joy

which I feel is like a deep it's happiness I feel like is that surf surface level kind of like emotion yeah but joy is that deep-seated like from right from your gut your belly your life has purpose you have meaning you have connection and I feel like that is a choice joy is a choice yeah um and I I want to choose it every single day every single day of my life I want there to be joy yeah I like that because I think yeah happiness joy like I feel that about like happiness I feel

as though that we have the opportunity that even when like I've said it a couple of times I think on this podcast so I apologize to everyone if I'm repeating myself but I think this is important that if you have that deep-seated happiness or joy about the opportunities that we have and the perspective and the gratitude and the feelings that we have to actually get that we get to do all these different things that even when stuff sucks like it's it won't suck forever yeah even when stuff's great and you're rolling and you're happy there

you go use that word but even when you're feeling like that it's not gonna last forever and understanding that and having that acceptance to be like okay whatever happens I'm gonna be okay yeah that's that feeling of joy just it's like the foundation for all that for me yeah and I think if you understand that and can accept it and just know that you know things are gonna happen and it's gonna be good it's gonna be bad you're gonna feel good and you know when we look back on all the times when we're have it

we have our deepest pain and suffering usually we can look back and go okay well that was an amazing period of personal growth or yeah or whatever so and most people I talk to say the same thing like you wouldn't want to experience it again but you wouldn't change it because that's shaped the next season or it's shaped who you are now and like that's my story I would never want to experience it again I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy but if those things didn't happen I wouldn't be sitting here being as confident

being as joyful and being as free as I am right now so I just would never change it tell me about that first trip to Kenya in 2017 yeah wow so yeah after the America trip fell through it's crazy how this happened and I still can't even really figure it out but so my mum has been going to Kenya for about 12 years now she has her own organization that takes small groups of people on short term mission trips to Kenya to Thailand and does a bunch of stuff locally as well so my mum has

a massive heart of mercy and wanting to see you know social justice and change around the world incredible woman shout out to mama Kaz ding so yeah she's been doing it for years and I haven't it was always really good for her I remember being like in my teenage years and she just kind of started doing it and I'm like that's really good for you but it's not for me and I remember feeling like as if you'd leave your own children to go and spend time with other children around the world like how rude well

first of all this goes to show like what I wear my mental state was yeah but yeah I don't know something changed in me and I can't even pinpoint what it was and when it was but I just knew I wanted to go I remember hearing all the stories from my mum and all of a sudden she'd be you know doing the uncle Arthur showing us the photos on the computer and telling the stories of these kids and like I would be getting emotional like what are these like what are these tears these have never

happened before yeah and then like all of a sudden things just started happening there was people who wanted to support me to go and I don't know whether that's because they maybe knew part of the story beforehand and all of that but people people yeah really wanted me to be there and as as other people wanted me to be there I wanted to be there more and all of a sudden I find myself in October 2017 getting on a plane to go to Kenya that's huge two and a half weeks yeah and it was yeah

the most life-changing experience of my life elaborate on that you don't know what to expect for me I'd never I've done up until that point I'd been on one overseas trip yeah I'd been to America after I graduated high school for a month with my family because they didn't want me to go on schoolies I had a choice mum and dad were like cool you can do schoolies or you can come on a fully paid trip to America and I was like tactical by them so yeah jumped on the plane and off I went and

it was yeah again the most incredible experience of my life there's went to a place called Haruma children's home which is a basically a boarding school for children who are either orphaned or don't have families or don't have safe families and it's an education facility as well as a home and spent two weeks there two and a half weeks there with I think there was about nine of us ten of us and yeah basically did everything from spend time with the kids listen to their stories like games with them kick a footy we also did

some project based stuff so we did something called a doctor basket where we filled up about I think it was about 400 baskets of locally purchased goods which would feed a small family of four for about a month so we did projects like that on the first trip and then yeah it was just incredible these kids we talked about resilience I tell you what resilience and joy you won't find more of that in these kids and these are children that have horrific backgrounds I mean obviously yeah I went back this year and got to spend

a bit more time there and heard a whole bunch more stories but even that first trip I remember meeting a small girl who is still one of my favorite little little legends ever she her mum is quite mentally ill works at the home and she's there with her two sisters but her mum can't really care for them so she they the children live at the home and her mum works there and so her mum every day will leave the home to go back home and come back and work for the day and yeah her mum's

in a position where she yeah can't can't care for them so they see her but they're not in that home family relationship and all of the interesting things that that brings along but yeah it was an incredible trip that changed my life and changed the trajectory of the next season of life for me tell me about the next season and how I guess because you probably would have experienced the trip and I guess those kind of trips it's hard to reflect especially two and a half weeks it's hard to reflect during what was that period

of reflection like when you got home yeah so I actually didn't come home yeah the heart one of the best and hardest things was I had this awesome two and a half weeks in Kenya and then I had a trip around the UK in Europe yeah yeah so I was away for six weeks in total and then spent a month traveling afterwards and so it was weird because everyone talks to you about culture shock you know you initially get there and the the shock of what you're experiencing and seeing and tasting and smelling and hearing

and then reverse culture shock which you know coming back to your own situation and and place of living and that time of processing what you're experiencing for me it was really different I'm an external processor like I figure out how I feel when I'm having a conversation or worry that when I'm journaling or whatever that might look like same yeah exactly like this is this is my jam I love this kind of thing let's talk about what I've experienced so I can understand me yeah good um but yes I was still in Kenya and I

knew that I knew that I knew that I was coming back like I was hadn't even left I think it was maybe a weekend and I was like I'm coming back and I'm going to be here for a significant period of time yeah so I had that in the back of my brain always knew I was going to be back but then once I got on the plane and I was on a plane to Scotland Edinburgh it's like okay I've experienced what I've experienced I've seen some of Kenya's most vulnerable young people I've seen you

know the Kabira slums where there's over a million people living in corrugated iron homes I've seen um you know places that don't have access to running water and that um gong slums where they're living in um their trash yeah but I've also seen the joy and the resilience of that community and now I'm a privileged white Australian going to experience the world because I can you know like it's it was really hard for me to consolidate the two parts of my trip yeah and I needed to stop viewing them as two parts and view them

as one experience um which yeah was was difficult um I was lucky obviously with my mum having gone there a fair bit I was lucky to be able to just continue the conversation with her and debrief with her but then I was able to use my time as opposed to feeling really bad about the opportunity that I've given to travel use that time to really process yeah because I think that's something like the first thing I thought I was okay did you look at that Europe trip as an opportunity or did you look at it

as like I shouldn't be doing this and you kind of feel that guilt around it yeah I I initially I thought I was going to and then I was like you know what I there's I've experienced so much in my own life that I can't be robbed of the opportunity that lies here yeah because of some because of how I feel I can't fix the issues of poverty I can't fix the issues of social justice but I can do something and I always knew that after that first trip um to Kenya my partnership there will

be lifelong um and so you know you can't do everything but you can do something and that's just how I want to live my life I like that a lot what was what was the I guess planning and subsequent like return home after that six weeks yeah what was that like because obviously you know you've come back to that life that was not the most stable thing in the world before you left and you've come back to it with all this new set newfound sense of I guess perspective and understanding of what else is happening

in the world how did that affect how you lived your life when you came back um yeah pretty significantly I would say I mean I probably didn't look that significant from the outside but internally like it was just such a significant change as I said I knew while I was still there that I wanted to go back so I came back and it was like that night I was telling my family I'm going back and it's going to be for at least three months um and so I got back end of November by the January

I had told both my bosses that I by the August would be resigning like I gave them so much notice but I would resign um because this is what I feel like is meant to be so it was weird having like eight nine months of notice knowing that there's this time that I'm going um and yeah still having to work and save and do all of that kind of thing but knowing that my heart was like this is what this season's about I had something to work towards because I knew I wanted to go back

but there be more a more significant purpose to the next trip back yeah um but the day-to-day stuff it's hard like I came back with you know the dirt on my feet from my first trip and it was almost like the dirt never left like it's set didn't it seat set seat seeped into my skin yeah I don't have to check that one yeah I'm not sure it got into my skin and just never left the the stories the faces just imprinted onto my heart in a really significant way yeah um and I get it

not everyone feels the the call to Africa and be with the children and not everyone feels the call to environmentalism but we've all got something that we're passionate about and I think once you find out what that is that's something that's something that's external to personal gain that's something that's external to um you know what I can get out of life once we find that thing I think that is such a significant point in life and I think and a significant part about being a well-adjusted adult is having a thing that's not about you um

yeah I think that's such a significant thing and that is one of the things that I think has changed the trajectory of my my life elevator pitch could you articulate your thing you know what I'm probably not right now I'm still I mean I'm fresh off my second trip yeah um and I'm still processing and I I don't know I just not in a neat tidy little bow but uh for life ain't neat and tidy so go nuts I think for me my life is about um my thing my thing is about helping people to

feel seen and understood and known and valued um people did that for me when I was in my my moments of of depression and anxiety and um I think when we're vulnerable we just want to feel known and um you know doesn't get more vulnerable than orphans and widows yeah that's my thing I just want people to know people around the world to know that they're valued and seen um especially with you know these kids with the stories that they have they're important they matter and um they they everyone should be given the opportunities that

we have you know education so significant but yeah I want people to know that they're valued how is that thing different to what it would have been if I asked you say five years ago it would have been about how I can feel seen and understood I felt so misunderstood you know in my early 20s late teens um it was all about how people could how I could get people to understand my perspective and who I am um you know and I'm still figuring that out I would say now more than ever I know who

I am I know how I'm wired and not only that but are confident in that um but yeah that's probably been flipped on its head you know as you continue to take your eyes off yourself you kind of see the needs of the world and the needs of people around you um and it puts things into perspective sometimes we all need a healthy dose of humility and um you know we might be the center of our own world but we're not the center of the world and then there are people that have greater needs and

greater struggles than us and it doesn't lessen what we experience it doesn't lessen our own needs and desires and and um experiences yeah I think it's under it's really important to understand that it is all relative like all of the the struggle and the suffering that we all go through just you know there's horrific and then there's you know what would some people would say is a regular struggle but we all experience it as the worst worst thing we've been through potentially or you know whatever so I think it's really important to understand that and

I think having being I've never experienced one big chunk in a single community but being fortunate enough to travel different parts of the world really really low socioeconomic areas and to see how people live and to see the contrast in terms of opportunity and I guess materialistic positions positions possessions compared to what we have here but then to see the contrast in in happiness and smiles and joy and yeah and appreciation for what they do have it's it's so I don't know it's one of those things that it really interests me and it's really easy

to forget that there's that you know there's there's other parts of the world where people are yeah going through those things I think too like one of the questions I get asked a lot is you know were you sad for them no I was sad for myself like I the tears that I was crying when I was there you know yes there are horrific stories and all of that but I wasn't crying because they're lacking you know I come back here and and I I feel sad for us I feel sad for the things that

we've prioritized and and the things that you know we think will bring us joy and fulfillment and it's just the Western way of living is so different I don't I don't feel sad for them I at all I look at their lives and I look at the community that they have it's so deep and rich and the joy that they experience and the faith that they have and the hope that they have despite situations and as a result the resilience that they have and I'm like oh we could all use a dose of that we

could all use a dose of that yeah I think it's important that resilience comes from experiencing some horrific things and comes from being able to develop coping mechanisms as they grow and as they as they go and I think for for you to be able to I guess dive into that that community and hear the stories and you know experience it through their voices and through their eyes and some it's a pretty powerful thing what are the you know obviously there's there'd be thousands of stories but what are there some stories that stick out that

you'd be able to share their experiences through your experience yeah yeah again there's a lot of stories and like to be honest there was a lot of kids that told me their stories and had never told anyone before and this Kenyan men especially don't cry yeah so when you got you know an 18 year old guy telling you his story of how he ended up at her room at the children's home and and you know the situation of what led him to that place and he's in tears like you know that that's a significant thing

you know that that level of trust that's built to be able to get to the point of someone telling their story for the very first time is such a significant thing and I I'm not gonna cry you're more than welcome yeah that's just something that I'll never forget yeah it's really significant and yeah but so yeah at the home there are about 16 children that are living with HIV at the moment one of the most significant days of the trip was the day that we went to the HIV clinic with these students the clinic itself

is in Kabira so if you know anything about Africa Kabira is one of the biggest slums in Africa housing you know houses over a million people and as I said corrugated iron homes limited access to clean water there's no kind of rubbish disposal other than the rubbish being burnt which is pretty common in Kenya so it's a really significant day anyway but yeah then one of the children told me her story and she obviously has HIV when her stepfather found out that she had HIV as a young child he threw battery acid all over her

trying to to kill her and so she's now quite disfigured and has scars on her face and her body but is again one of the most beautiful kind loving girls that I've ever met and so again you you hear these stories and you see the person that's in front of you and you find it hard to find that connection it's almost like the stories are so significant and so raw that it's really hard in the moment to be like to comprehend it I can't comprehend someone feeling like that's an appropriate response at all yeah so

I mean that's one of hundreds of stories there's stories of of abandonment there was there's a small child a baby under the age of one that's at the home at the moment that I believe was born in a forest and left in the forest and how that child wasn't eaten by hyenas I have no idea like surely by the grace of God or something you know a small child yeah yeah abandonment abuse of a physical variety there's you know step parents parents all kinds of different family members and close people who just take advantage of

situations and then obviously sexual abuse as well which is quite significant so yeah every child has a story not all of them sound the same not all of them are as horrific but every child has a story and once you start to hear some of the stories and connect with these kids it's pretty hard not to fall in love with them but then again we all have a story right we've all got our stories and they're not going to look the same but they're significant yeah and they're ours and one of the things that is

really beautiful about the African culture is that vulnerability and that willingness to share and I would love to see that be a thing here too you know do you think it's changing I think it is I think it is slowly I don't know it is in the circles that I run in which is really good because I love sharing I love talking about this kind of stuff I love talking about people's experiences and and getting to know them better because I feel like I can't do surface level anymore I it's it's not enough it's not

enough for me I mean and there'll always be people that aren't you don't go to that deeper place with but for me I want to find those deep spirited friends those friendships where people can call you out on your bullshit because they know you because they know your story and yeah I think it is changing and I think that's a beautiful thing 100 I think if those circles that share that people are vulnerable and that they share things and share their fears and desires and hopes and dreams and that kind of stuff then all you're

going to do by showing that vulnerability is attract other people that want to show that yeah that whole that whole surface level thing the small talk thing like I get it I think it's I feel the same way a lot of the time and I think it's you know it's important to be able to be polite and have a conversation with someone but at the same time you know if you spend your whole week talking about the weather you're gonna get to the end of the week and nothing's changed yeah I think it's really important

to be able to learn through experience of experiences of other people and experiences yourself but then like I said if you're able to have these these conversations if you're able to put it all out in the journal then it helps you process it yeah and that vulnerability something that I've noticed myself and staff and clients and the Virtus family the people when they are vulnerable like those barriers they've put either put in front of themselves or imagine in front of themselves they tend to crumble away pretty quickly and it's not just for you it's for

other people too that freedom and permission you give other people to be unapologetically themselves is so significant I think I spent too long calling myself an emotional person I'm so emotional and so that's such a negative thing it was like that switch of going like yeah I'm emotional but I'm passionate and emotional doesn't have to mean crying like I cry all the time I cry if I'm not between a four and a seven on the emotional scale I'm crying yeah crying when I'm happy I'm crying when I'm sad but I think when we can kind

of be vulnerable enough with ourselves and with other people it gives them permission to do the same and I think only good can come of that yeah 100% what are the things that I guess you talked about the circles that you do run in what are those circles and how have you found them to be beneficial in terms of like finding your people yeah I think they've they've changed a bit but also not at the same time so I probably have like a core group of friends who have kind of been around for the last

maybe 10 plus years and they're easy friendships like these are deep friendships but they're easy so I'm not gonna list them all but for the ones that you do know like Sam and Eliza have been yeah and the twins have been such a significant part of my life for the last 10 plus years yeah they're they're people that are like no bullshit no judgment type friends like I could turn up to their house at four o'clock in the morning being an absolute mess and they would just be completely fine with it they're people that like

are with me and celebrating the winds but also in the trenches with me when I'm you know struggling and need a comrade and knowing that you've got that is almost enough like even when you're not experiencing the crap stuff knowing that you've got those people around you is such a significant thing I think now is as I'm an adult and and processing what friendships look like it's less about quantity and more about quality like I want good people in my life I don't care if I have you know a tiny group of friends if they're

the right people for me I'm about it and that's enough for me but I think it's also about finding the communities that aren't just based around friendships so like without giving you too much of a big head Virtus has been really significant for me because it's a different community outside of the one that's been you know that 10 plus years it's fresh it's different but it's also fulfilling purpose in another aspect as well so Virtus kind of came along at a time where like they needed to be a change in my life in a physical

aspect but I also didn't realize how much the kind of community side of it was needed as well something fresh and different in that aspect so that's been a really significant addition to my world as well I mean I sent me that text message the other day like made me feel warm fuzzy I'm so glad that's what it's about right after three months four and a half months in Kenya and building the community and the relationships that I built there like oh man I've been struggling so hard since being back because it was such a

significant time but then knowing that I had like a Virtus to come back to where it's a different community but it's community nonetheless has been um been really awesome and it's made that adjustment um less painful yeah maybe not less painful that's easier yeah definitely talk to me about that four and a half months because it wasn't planned as four and a half months initially right yeah so I planned to go over to Kenya this year uh 2018 for three months and the three months that I was going to spend there had a purpose um

so it was going to be three months of um using my skill set and my passions and abilities to help Haruma tell their story um so my background is administration and a bit of marketing um so I would work with their office team as well obviously as well as spending time with the kids which was super high priority for me um was to spend time in the office with their office team and kind of help them engage in social media um the use of like newsletters and whatnot to be able to tell their story which

was awesome so we did that for three months um it was really significant we were able to get a whole bunch of new supporters for the home um there was people from overseas who were you know wanting to donate it was came at a really significant time for the home they were really struggling financially just because of some um uh American sponsors who were changing how they were doing things yeah um so yeah we were through the use of life we set them up on MailChimp they were initially sending a word document as an attachment

for their newsletter which was like crazy but yeah we set them up on like an e-newsletter we started doing some more videos um told some of the stories of the kids showed the home more talked to mama zipporah who again is the most incredible woman that I know um shout out to mama zip uh yeah and then from that like Kenyans would come with what they had this is the other thing right generosity Kenyans that would come in massive groups and give what they had whether it was um clothes whether it was a bag of

rice whether it was you know hundreds of dollars worth of food they would come with what they had because they saw a need yeah um again there's something to think about for us westerners what are we doing when we see the needs of the people around us um and so yeah and it was really significant the three months that we were doing that but then it cut as my d-day for going home approached I just didn't feel ready and I was like oh is this just because I know I miss everyone this is just because

um you know that it's sad to leave but I just couldn't shake the fact that I didn't think I was meant to go home so I was processing what that looked like and talking to a couple of other volunteers that were there at the time and mama zipporah and we figured out that when I left there would be even though I was training up someone to do the stuff that I was doing we recognized that there would still be a bit of a significant gap um and what I was setting up wasn't as sustainable as

it could be anyway long story short is we kind of came up with a plan and I created a idea that I pitched to mama for a social media internship that would be directed at one of the graduating students of the um year 12s yeah um and a student who isn't necessarily strong academically but um is creative is good with technology is able to tell a story let's use those skills train them up to be able to step into a position a paid position um in 2019 that they can partner with the home in this

internship and continue the work that we've been doing the three months before so we created the haruma social media internship and that's why I stuck around for an extra month and a half to be able to spend one on one time training one on one time training up the social media intern which is so good because I mean he's incredible his name's David he's funny he's cheeky he's really good at what he does um and he will be able to tell this haruma story better than anyone having lived there been there breathed it yeah and

yeah so that's that's that what was it like having the first couple of months obviously being obviously not out of the community are for that last month and a half but obviously the first couple of months was heavily based around the community and immersing yourself and and being a part of that and helping in a wider range and then going to kind of one person and mentoring for for that last month and a half what was it like with that shift did it did it change perspective or thought patterns or anything like that not really

I mean the person that we selected for the role um which was there was a process in that anyway but this person that ended up being selected was probably someone that I'd already built a really strong connection with um which you know was so good it was so good to be able to be like yeah I know you I know your skills um we have a friendship already and we just believe in you so we're able to just completely invest in him yeah um it was it was easy it felt really natural and it felt

really easy and um it was really enjoyable like it was we made it fun like we were able to go around and and film the kids singing merry Christmas and and joy to the world and you know like getting ready for Christmas stuff and we were able to um go out and take photos in gong the local town and um you know share a meal together and and you know these he became like a best friend like I facetimed him for an hour last night like how good is technology I don't know what we did

before being able to just facetime people from around the world it was hard in the sense of um like the community and the friendships that I was building it it's not that they became secondary but the focus for that month and a half was David yeah um and so some of the younger ones saw me a little bit less um and that was hard for them um but whenever I was available I was with the kids as soon as as soon as we were done with training for the day it was like out playing soccer

with the kids and you know I taught them baby shark and every time I'd step out of the guest house to support little Zapora I would say brookside baby shark baby shark and I just had to tell her no baby shark's sleeping I can't deal with baby shark anymore baby shark is asleep um but yeah it was really good I think coming back um obviously you'd had these last maybe 12 months kind of experiencing um Kenny for the first time coming back and basically straight away going this is what I'm going to be doing having

eight months to to work and and look forward to something what was it like coming back and how did you prepare for I guess your re-entry into this part of the world um it's been so hard like I've been back for a week now um I'm still figuring it out and it's it's partly still jet lag but it's also partly because like I'm mad I just miss it I miss it so much like I said if someone was to give me a chunk of money I'd be back on a plane stat yeah I don't know

like I'm I'm trying to figure it out I have an incredible job to step into this year which I'm so excited about um I have an awesome new home that I'm in at the moment um but my god my heart's still in the gong hills like I I can't can't shake it and so it's figuring it's been a week mate I know and it's probably never gonna not be there right and this is what I said like it's it's being kind enough to myself to go like okay there is going to be a grief process

and I probably wasn't aware of how much it would affect me being back because I knew all the things I've got to look forward to you know like Christmas and summer if the sun wants to come out you know new years and the new job and all of that kind of stuff there's so much good stuff happening um I just probably thought that that would overshadow the grief of moving um but it's significant how I feel right now is is significant and it won't always feel like this I hope but there will always be something

there and as I said this is this is something I feel is a lifelong partnership and it won't always look like living in Kenya sometimes it will look like being a pen pal or a face timing you know or sponsoring your child or whatever it might be but I'd say it's a lifelong partnership and yeah as I continue to kind of grieve not being present with that community um it's just being kind to myself in the process which I'm aware of um being aware of and then being able to feel it and act upon it

and believe it is the two different four different things like my house at the moment is just filled with African music I'm waiting for the chance for me to chuck on my my African playlist at Virtus and just like yeah just any opportunity to be able to talk about it and continue to process it yeah I know Mitch is like oh did you go to Africa did you go to Kenya it's like yes and let me talk about it for the next six months yeah and then oh that that's a joke that started when Coop

went to the UK which apparently Coop went to the UK for a while yeah he's been bringing it up for the last 12 18 months um Mitch went to the US as well we're pretty aware of that did he watch a baseball game mate he turned into a baseball I guess is it on that note is it difficult because all you would want to talk about I'm sure is Kenya right yeah you'd want to process and and and and help other people experience it through you and and all these different things is it hard to

kind of like not that you need to but is it hard to like bite your tongue and kind of go okay well maybe people don't want to hear about it every minute of every day yeah yeah it is but I'm super aware of it so um not everyone wants to hear about it and not everyone even when they do want to hear about it people don't understand they'll try to but they you know they'll mean so well but they won't understand because you know they weren't there they didn't live it and breathe it and smell

it that's a good point for everyone's experiences and problems and and struggles ever I think it's being able to you know listen and try to understand about having that knowledge that no one's going to get it 100 um but for me I'm so lucky so um for both trips my mum was there for a period of time so while I was there for the four and a half months my mum came with a team of people yeah um one of whom is one of my very good friends Sophie um I just I'm looking for excuses

to get the vowel now um and so I've got good people who have been there and and understand and if I didn't have that I would find it really hard I'm still finding it really hard but yes it's it's easier knowing that there's people that have been there and done it um maybe not for four and a half months but know the community and are happy to look at photos and hear how I'm feeling and um yeah but it's still hard it's still really hard you it's almost like I want people to understand because um

you know this is something that's significant to me and so having other people understand that is cool but at the same time not everyone's going to be as passionate about the orphans and widows in Africa as they are about animals or you know and we need people passionate about all different things I understand I think it's really important to never you know put it trying to put a dampener or put something over top of your passion and what you're actually really passionate about like you know whether it is single-use plastics or whether it's you know

what you're passionate about whether it's what I'm passionate about if you can find that thing that I'll use the term set your soul on fire and get out to the world then like carry on if you haven't found that thing keep looking because you'll get there eventually and encourage it yeah encouraging people to pursue that whatever it is for them yeah um but that doesn't mean that yours is more significant or less significant than anyone else's it's just different I think it's like like I was talking about before once you find that thing for you

like pursue it with everything that you have and that's not only good for the community that you're partnering with but it's good for you yeah takes your eyes off yourself and your own little bubble and into the you know the needs that our world has and I think only good can come from that 100 tell me about your parents they are actually the best people that I know I know like people have different relationships with their parents and whatnot but like in all honesty my parents are probably the coolest parents that exist so um I've

always been really close with my parents um my I've grown up maybe in a different environment than most people so my dad is a pastor of a church so I grew up in a pretty christian background um they walked through the first church we went to with me as a baby in their arms and we didn't leave that particular church until I was about 17 years old yep um so yeah I've always kind of had a really cool um like uh grounding in like morals and and um encouragement and love like such a loving family

um but now as an adult like being able to choose how that relationship looks with my family um is so significant I just my dad is one of my best mates like I made him change the dates of when he was playing my parents are moving interstate which is again going to be so significantly hard but made dad change the dates he's moving so we could have an up last boxing day test together watch the cricket amazing sink a few frothies and just enjoy the day um but yeah we just get along so well my

parents are staying with me at the moment before they move and um they I know that they would do anything for me they're my biggest supporters and always have been always have been there's never a time where I felt like I haven't made my parents proud even when I've been a little shit and made really poor choices I've never questioned um never questioned their love for me which again has been such a significant part of just feeling released to make choices whether good bad or ugly I know that I've always got a good good family

behind me I love that yeah how's your I guess growing up the Christian household how's your faith affected who you are and who you've become and who you're becoming um I would say that for like I was all about it for my younger years I think it's like it gets to a point if you've grown up in a really religious I don't like that word if you've grown up in like a Christian family there gets a point in your life where you're like this needs to be mine if this is if this is true if

I believe this to be truth it needs to not be something that has been taught to me by whoever my family whatever it needs to become a choice that I've made um and probably like I went through a good few years of rebellion in my like late teens early 20s which like more often than not tell you what pastors kids they're crazy bunch um yeah and so where I was like this is bullshit like I don't know what I believe I don't know where it all sits um like a bit of rebellion against what my

parents believed yeah but I think it was more I would say that like I've always had a faith and always had a belief in God um and like always loved the person of who Jesus is and the Bible and stuff and the way that he lived his life was all about other people so that was really significant for me as far as like someone of character but wasn't until I had my massive breakdown that I was like it needs to be less about what I believe in my head and more about how I'm living my

life and this needs to become like a significant action as opposed to just a belief and so it's always been something that's there and something that I'm passionate about but I think post post the breakdown I was like yeah this is a reality for me and it's not just going to be about something that makes me feel good and warm and fuzzy it's going to be something that's going to change my lifestyle and yeah I think since then it's probably something that's been kind of setting my setting my soul on fire and and increased passion

for people and a kindness for myself and um yeah I would say faith is definitely something that gives my life purpose I don't think that I could have done the last season that I did in Kenya and hearing the stories that I did without you know and seeing the way that they live their lives like Haruma is such a significant place of faith you know and I look at these kids and if they didn't have that faith grounding or that something to believe in I would would hate to think of where their life would be

because I think that you know we talk about how um healing and having that space to process is really significant for resilience I believe that absolutely is true but I think especially in this community having that faith is significant for healing and is significant for resilience and significant for joy so I would rock up to their Sunday services at the church and like I've never seen kids jump like they've jumped like there is a deep joy that comes out when they just are you know being free in what they believe and it's a really beautiful

thing so I'm constantly challenged by what I believe like especially in the climate of where we live you know in the time that we live at the moment and all the questions I have more questions than answers I'm okay in that space even as someone that's kind of grown up in the faith I continually have questions and I continually um you know have very heated conversations with God and other people around like what I believe and why I believe what I believe and um there was a time where I didn't ask questions um and that

was really unhealthy but I think as long as we're asking questions even if they're really tough and even if we don't have the answers um I think that's a really healthy space to be I like that it's cool I have three questions for you to finish off what are you proud of I'm proud of myself and that sounds real cheesy and probably maybe a little bit cocky but my God it's taken me a long time to be able to say that and say that confidently I am so proud of who I am I don't want

to get emotional again that's such a weird thing to get emotional about that's not but like the last few years have been the most devastating and the most beautiful of my life and I just feel really proud of the fact that I just didn't give up when everything in me was telling me to give up I'm just really glad that I didn't and I'm proud of that I love that those two words don't have to be opposing things I think not at all and it's oh yeah yeah that's I'll leave it there twice what are

you confident about what are you most confident about um I'm so confident that this world is full of beauty and is full of beautiful people and beautiful things and after coming back from Kenya like even more so than ever before you know after seeing tough stuff you also see the beauty behind it as well I'm fully confident that this world is beautiful and there are incredible people here and I'm confident that that will continue to be the case as we take our eyes off ourselves and look to others good answer what are you most excited

for 2019 I feel like every year since 2017 after that significant time in my life in 2016 every year for me has gotten bigger and better and I just have such high hopes for 2019 for myself for my community and just in general 2019 is going to be a really big and awesome year and I say bring it on awesome another question I couldn't finish on three what so one of the things you said to me early on was you had to discern between old brook and new brook and I thought it was really powerful

so if old brook was sitting in a position I am now and you're looking across the table at old brook what would you say to her oh that's a really big question I would just say you're worth it you're worth pushing through you're worth investing in um you are worth taking the time um and you are so much greater and so much less significant than you realize like it's that paradox of being so significantly insignificant right which is I love having that conversation with people because I think meaning comes from our significant lack of meaning

right yeah yeah and I that was the probably like the most frustrating thing but it was so significant like I'm everything but I am nothing um and it was when I kind of started to wrap my head around that that things changed but I would just say poor little brook like take your eyes off the ground be confident who you are and you know hold your head up high walk with confidence and um just you wait just you wait stick it out and just watch what happens your life is about to be set on fire

in the most significant way and um it's not because of anything you've done it's not because of anything that you are it's just because it is what it is and as we continue to you know walk through life and make choices that will bring us joy and bring others joy it's yeah it's significant so yeah that's wonderful thanks for coming on thanks having a chat and thanks for sharing oh my pleasure I'll do it again sometime 100 percent how can people get around Haruma how can people find a sponsored child how can people start to

see and experience in smaller ways the world that you have experienced awesome so I would love to talk about it um but if you wanted to just jump online and check it out um Haruma children's home uh is on Facebook as well as my mum's organization that organizes the child sponsorship so that's go beyond all borders um both have websites and both are on Facebook otherwise I'm always up for a coffee and a chat good brook thanks again thanks lucky